Something different

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 15 Apr 2007, 05:47

AI Tanks

Just getting started.

RipPipPip · Post by **RipPipPip** » 15 Apr 2007, 07:34

Oh, interesting, Mike ...
it's gonna be a static for a scenery or a movable one?

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 15 Apr 2007, 17:00

Both!

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 16 Apr 2007, 02:19

Some "proof of concept" type of images, showing the tanks, as ai, moving around.

Click to enlarge:

BadPvtDan · Post by **BadPvtDan** » 16 Apr 2007, 02:20

Good stuff, Mike. You need to make it so we can see Operation Desert Storm!

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 16 Apr 2007, 02:22

Unfortunately there are some limitations assiciated with AI vehicles. The main one being that you wouldn't ever want to connect them to an actual runway, or they would actually take off and fly!

Secondly since they are following fake taxiways, they can only drive on flat surfaces like those immediately around an airport. Any elevation change in the land mesh and they will either appear to float above the surface or dissappear beneath it. Plus using AFCAD taxiways creates sort of a poor mans flatten file along the taxiway which will distort the landscape a bit.

BadPvtDan · Post by **BadPvtDan** » 16 Apr 2007, 02:37

Ah well, tanks always scared me anyway.

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 16 Apr 2007, 16:45

AI UBoats..........hmmmmmmmmm.........

CrazyDunc · Post by **CrazyDunc** » 16 Apr 2007, 17:12

Mike did u just make tht?

Dunc

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 16 Apr 2007, 18:33

I did indeed. The wake effect and .air file are from a FS9 usable submarine.

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 17 Apr 2007, 04:12

That's looking better now.

Savage · Post by **Savage** » 17 Apr 2007, 16:13

Forgive my dumb question, but how exactly do Ai Tanks/boats etc actually work? You couldn't give them runways because they'd take off, so how would you move them yet stop them doing that?

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 18 Apr 2007, 17:05

Not a dumb question at all. I have to give credit to Holgar Sandman for his and others' work on this area. I would have never figured it out on my own, that's for sure.

Here's the basic concept. You create an afcad file with very, very, very long taxi segments, using ramp taxi links (the green lines) with a width of 1 foot so they are not really visable. But you never connect the taxi links to a runway because as you correctly stated the ground bound AI would indeed try to take off. So you basically terminate the taxi links at a runway taxi link (the black line) and do not connect it to an actual runway. So your ai generate in their parking spots when you enter the active AI area, start their taxi towards the non-existent runway and slowly make their way along their very extended taxi segments. When they do reach the end of their taxi links they will come to a stop and eventually dissappear, and that's the drawback. So the idea is to make the taxi segments long enough to give you plenty of time to sail your vessel or drive your vehicle around without noticing that it will eventually dissappear.

Here's an example of a "shipping" afcad. To give you an idea of the scale, I've superimposed the Hawaiian island of Oahu on top of this afcad, which is where the afcad is actually located. So at the speed the boats "taxi" at, it will take a long time for them to reach the end of their taxi segments.

Water vessels are ideal for AI since the ocean is at sea level, so it should be roughly the same mesh height. If you run into varying heights in the terrain mesh, that's where you run into problems. That's why AI vehicles don't work as well as boats do.

Weescotty · Post by **Weescotty** » 18 Apr 2007, 17:55

Why not add the vehicles as dynamic scenery?
Don't need an AFCAD for them then.

Check the thread here -

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showth ... ic+scenery

Misha_K · Post by **Misha_K** » 18 Apr 2007, 19:56

MIKE JG wrote:I did indeed. The wake effect and .air file are from a FS9 usable submarine.

Couldn't one save a lot of polys by not modeling the bottom of the sub? It's invisible in FS anyway, no?

Savage · Post by **Savage** » 18 Apr 2007, 22:11

Thank you for the detailed description.

One problem I'm having, the Carrier I'm using will not appear on the water parking, yet when I put into a standard airport it appears, any thoughts?

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 18 Apr 2007, 23:53

@Kevin,

Yea modeling the land vehicles as dynamic scenery may be the way to go, would probably be easier that way. As for the boats, I think it's more fun to have them as AI, allows the user to make their own "cruises" as well.

@Misha,

By virtue of their relatively simple shape (submarines) they don't have that many polys to begin with. Only problem I could see with cutting the bottom off of the boats is that they might not behave as well in the water. They actually do bob up and down even as AI. If I cut the bottom half off, they may not react the same way. I'll try it and see what happens. I have a feeling that I'd have to change the .air files and change the contact points to get them back to the proper displacement in the water. Certainly if they are just being used as static scenery there would be no harm in cutting the bottom half off.

@Savage,

Sounds like an afcad/aircraft.cfg entry issue. One big issue is making sure that you use the correct parking radius for these AI boats. The radius they use is quite large. You can check out the radius that the designer set by using the "Aircraft Editor" feature in the Tools menu in AFCAD. Double check what the listed radius for your carrier is and make sure that your designated parking spot for your ship afcad is big enough. If that doesn't do the trick double check the parking type and parking code in the aircraft.cfg entry. You may have to create a custom parking code for the AI carrier to show up.

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 19 Apr 2007, 13:01

Well a little trial with a "half a sub", cut the bottom off to see what would happen. Reduced the poly count by about a third. FSDS shows 215 polys vs. about 300 for the whole version. So definetely an improvement. And no real change in the models's behaivor in the water without a "bottom" section on it. Probably a good thing to use after for all LODs after LOD1.

This is a version with a DSRV riding piggyback:

Also someone was asking about the transparency of the surface of the water and whether or not you could see features of the model below the surface. Welll after looking at it again, the answer is yes you can indeed see some of the model below the surface.

MIKE JG · Post by **MIKE JG** » 19 Apr 2007, 14:20

Finally the family photo:

CrazyDunc · Post by **CrazyDunc** » 19 Apr 2007, 14:54

u doin any russian subs? i could use a russian, make the attack on my a/c carrier a bit more realistic

Dunc