A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

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TimC340
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A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 » 09 Jun 2019, 21:12

Yes, for real. Announced at E3 today, 9 June 2019.


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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by volador » 09 Jun 2019, 21:34

oooh!
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Jive1 » 10 Jun 2019, 06:20

Please let me have any news about this new Flight Simulator as soon as available.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird » 10 Jun 2019, 06:35

Well as its for Xbox I am not hopeful.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 » 10 Jun 2019, 06:52

Firebird wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 06:35
Well as its for Xbox I am not hopeful.
Not so. It will be for both X-Box and PC. Whether it will be open-source is yet to be announced.

I assume it will be an ‘X-Box Play Anywhere’ title, which means it will run on both. X-Box is only a tied-down PC inside anyway, so most of its games are PC-compatible.

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird » 10 Jun 2019, 07:04

Appreciate the update. The reason I am sceptical is that if it is to run on Xbox then I am not hopeful that you can amend it like you can for FS9/FSX/P3D.
I would love to be proved wrong but I am not sure that it will be an open architecture.

However, I would love to be proved wrong. The one thing it does show is that MS realises that there is revenue to be made in this area.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird » 10 Jun 2019, 07:21

I have just read a piece on this on Neowin.
It does confirm that it will be released on PC first. What it also mentions is 'Azure AI to build a world vastly more comprehensive than its predecessors'.

Now obviously I am reading between the lines here and making a lot of guesswork but the name being Azure AI says that AI will be cloud based. What I think is going to happen is that you will be connected to an MS server and everybody in the world will be seen by everybody else.
What I think this means is that there may not be any personal installable AI so traffic will be limited to whatever aircraft people are flying. For this to happen it likely means that you will not be able to create your own aircraft as the plane will have to be seen by everybody else i.e uploaded to the server. Taking this supposition further it means that only MS, and later on licensed producers, aircraft will be available to the AI system.

I hope that my early diagnosis of what info has come out so far is wrong.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 » 10 Jun 2019, 07:55

I suspect you’re right, Steve. But I think we have enough to keep us occupied with P3D for now, so we can watch this new MSFS from a neutral viewpoint until its structure and future becomes clear. I doubt there’s anyone left at MS who was involved with ACES and FS9/FSX, so the community aspect that was once so important may be overlooked. That said, every good multiplayer game has a strong community and the devs take that community for granted at their peril. If enough long-term FS users get involved, it may become open to community mods in the same way that Skyrim and others are.

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Jive1 » 10 Jun 2019, 08:55

Hey!
You must see the video that MS made, and it will give you a better ideaof what the new FS will be….
Go to


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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TheFoufure » 10 Jun 2019, 09:17

I hope that all new great models released by John Young will be compatibles... ;-)

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by petebramley » 10 Jun 2019, 12:08

This looks very interesting but raises a great many questions. I’m sure we will get some answers over the coming months. I may have to hold fire on any further P3D add-on purchases until things become clearer.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 » 10 Jun 2019, 12:38

Jive1 wrote:
10 Jun 2019, 08:55
Hey!
You must see the video that MS made, and it will give you a better ideaof what the new FS will be….
Go to


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Jive1 - Belgium

This video is P3Dv4.4. It is NOT anything to do with the new MSFS, which will not be released till next year (2020).

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Manschy » 10 Jun 2019, 17:05

Just stream? No Manschy.
No personal use? No Manschy.
No MAIW products on this? No Manschy!
Regards, Manfred.

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird » 10 Jun 2019, 17:27

Obviously a lot more info on the system and how it works has to be released so whilst I am sceptical at the moment I remain hopeful that my initial thoughts are in error.

The more I thought about this the more niggling doubts that I have.
For instance, IF everybody signs onto a cloud server to play, and creates a dynamic AI we WILL get the situation where idiots who don't want to fly properly can screw things up for everybody else. People jumping in line at an airport to take off or cutting people up to land, or a small group just blocking an airport by sitting still at a hold short point.

When I got to this point I decided to stop hypothesizing any more as I was starting to slip down the rabbit hole.

Here's hoping that there are intending to ask orgs like AIG and MAIW to supply AI to their servers and everybody just flys alone on their own machines UNLESS they want to network.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Greg » 10 Jun 2019, 19:38

I haven't read anything about networked user AI Steve so I'm not sure where you're getting that from, but as far as I understand it "Azure AI" is just plain AI instantiated on Azure cloud computers and then injected into your system, just like weather engines already do for weather.

So in a way it's very similar to UTLive where timetables are located in a cloud. You send a request for AI to the cloud with some parameters, e.g. your location, requested traffic densitiy,... after which you personal AI object is instantiated on a cloud computer and sent back to your simulator for injection.

So you could call it "AI as a service" rather than leaving it up to the user to install all timetables manually or with a payware proggie and then let the sim calculate all sector entries and instantiate the AI bubble on the user's computer each time a scenario is loading. The cloud way requires more bandwidth, but it saves up a ton of CPU power on the local PC.

Now this again is speculation and your guess is as good as mine, but Azure is all about cloud computing and payware AI developers are already moving into this direction so it would make perfect sense.

Although while making perfect sense for 95% of the simmers who already buy their AI traffic (from which MS currently doesn't get one cent), it remains to be seen of course how much AI customisation remains possible...

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 » 11 Jun 2019, 02:38

Azure, at its simplest level, seems to be a way of hosting developer-created AI routines and content which, as Greg says, reduces the load on the client PC and allows the AI developer to retain control of their product. If third-party developers are allowed - and I’d suggest it would be impossible to create a flightsim with greater detail than P3D without third-party developers - this seems like a sensible way of getting their content into the sim in the most efficient and reliable way.

The sticking point will be whether freeware is allowed to be hosted in this way - or if there might be a more traditional method of injecting freeware into the sim. That will depend on how much control Microsoft wants over the user experience, and where in the sim market they want to pitch this product. Is it a game or is it something more serious and adaptable?

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird » 11 Jun 2019, 08:24

The key thing here is the unknown which will only be discovered as time goes on.
My best hope is that the Azure AI can be called upon to supplement your local AI rather than supplant it. The main reason for this is that I can't see MS getting into the admin business to manage third party addons for the AI engine.

Of course I do hope that they update the rules for the AI engine at the same time. It is long overdue. There are lots of things that I would like but the three main ones I would like to see would be :-
1. that AI aircraft could be flight planned to use waypoints and levels instead of just destinations.
2. that all airfields have to be set to operate either Civil or Military rules. The Military rules include pairs takeoffs and landings and to cover the 'aircraft on well down the runway' landings.
3. that ATC zones are better defined so that aircraft can fly at cruise speed at low level outside of control ( i.e low level training ).

Time will tell.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by John Young » 11 Jun 2019, 08:53

And....

4. props that spin up.

5. simple annotation of parking spots to prevent pushbacks.

6. Reversion to part names for animation (as in FS9) rather than the hugely time wasting and tedious animation tags.

7. Lights that don't bulge when specified in the aircraft.cfg file (as in P3Dv4).

John

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by DaleRFU » 11 Jun 2019, 17:03

It would be nice if they could make it so that we could use VFR flightplans for our type of AI to fly to waypoints rather than having to have them as IFR.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Sophie Marketa » 28 Jun 2019, 03:17

I am truly excited by the announcement of the new Microsoft platform. While we still have other simulator platforms to continue building our personalised graphic development, this new simulator looks to offer a different kind of immersion and hopefully will see real life updates to airports as they appear on satellite. I'm sure if Microsoft are coming back into the flight sim business after more than a decade out of the game, I feel confident they have something really special to offer to us that will have to rival P3D and X-Plane in order to make it worth their while. If the new platform does not live up to our expectations, it will at very least put the wind up the other simulator companies to get their act together on the level of graphic and living world objects that can now be delivered via a home PC for our entertainment.
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