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Windows 10 file need

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Firebird
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Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

Gents,
It seems that installing FS9 on a fresh Windows 10 1909 is a lot harder than anybody thought, i.e. you can't.

To try a work around can anybody that has Windows 8/8.1 do me a favour and pm me a copy of their secdrv.sys file. I believe that it will be version v 4.3.86.0

Thanks in advance.

For anybody remotely interested on a clean Windows 10. FS9 will install but not run. The FS9.1 patch fails with a driver error ( but conveniently doesn't tell you what driver is the problem).
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by morbidfred »

Hope this helps,

Gav
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

Thanks very much. It is part of a convoluted away around the blocking of the secure mechanism.
I will report if I get any luck with it.
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by VulcanDriver »

Thankfully I've not "upgraded" to windows 10. Still using W7 on my FS9 box.
John

"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

It seems the upgrade does not effect anything. I have reinstalled several times over the years, Including with 10.

The issue appears to be that apart from the security mechanism being removed there are other parts that the game needs to work.
This is the first time with a start from scratch PC with no OS and going straight to 10.

The issue I am getting at the moment is that the initial install does not complete properly and lyou can't start the game straight from the install. The FS9.1 update fails on startup with an error code 34, which seems to indicate a driver issue but it doesn't tell you which one. I am inclined, at the moment, to think that it is the security driver that it is looking for. This was removed from 10.

So, can''t install, can't upgrade and even if you then put in the No CD patch for 9.0 it hangs on loading.

My thinking at the moment is that something is missing from 10 that was in earlier versions that allowed it to work, but only because updates to the OS didn't delete what was already installed. Whether it is VB libraries or something else I have no idea but it fails.

It is a challenge.
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by TimC340 »

Steve, I’ve recently commissioned a new PC from scratch, running Win10 1909. Doing some work with John, it would seem useful to have FS9 installed so I can compile stuff for those of you who insist on antediluvian software(!). If I can find my ancient external DVD player, I’ll have a go at getting it running and see if I suffer the same problems - and whether I can find a solution. You’ll have to wait until after Christmas for a report, but I’ll have a go.

The new PC? Ryzen 9 3900X, Radeon 5700XT, 32Gb 3600 RAM, 7TB storage, including 2TB M2 PCIE v4.0. It’s a beast - but P3Dv4.5 still takes about 5 minutes to load!
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by John Young »

Steve, do you think the same problem would also affect FSX on a new Windows 10 PC with latest software? I'm sure Lockheed Martin would have enough clout with Microsoft so that P3D does not suffer the same fate, or maybe it's irrelevant since their program isn't installed from a DVD.

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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by TimC340 »

John, the PC I've just built runs freshly-installed P3D and FSX:SE without any issues.
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by John Young »

Tim, FSX:SE (Steam) is installed from a download I think. I wonder if FSX installed from DVDs is OK.
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

Guys. I do think that the problem is related to CDRom protection, therefore FSX:SE shouldn't have the issue.

I still have my installation backed up but the weird thing is that when I used Martins tool that sets the FS9 registry entry the program loads with no problem a saved vanilla FS9.1 installation.

The problem is that when I use my saved installation from before it loads up as far as the main window but then there is nothing but a black screen for the select aircraft and the program hangs when you try to select any window.
I got some success when I inactivated all but the default sceneries and then gradually built up the number activated.

I got to a point where it loaded with number 50 but not when i included number 49. The natural though was a problem with that scenery but in fact it happened with all sceneries after a certain number.
It was like I had reached a limit to the number of sceneries allowed. This is when I started thinking about something that was part of the OS earlier on.
I found and installed the last package released for DirectX 9 libraries and that increased the limit so that up to scenery priority 45 would load but no further. This seems to reinforce the idea that it is a missing OS installation.

This is when I decided to install from the disks and found the current problem.

Possibly more annoying is that I got it to load all sceneries and I got to test load Seattle and it was fine. I exited and then it then hangs every other time.

Very frustrating. It could be that I am doing something stupid but so far I have not found anything.

Tim, if you get to try and load the original CDs and then patch it I would be interested in what you find out.
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by TimC340 »

John, yes you’re quite right; FSX:SE is a download via the Steam client. I do have FSX on disk, but I seem to remember that FSX and FSX:SE won’t successfully sit side-by-side, presumably due to duplicated registry entries.

Steve, I have found a DVD drive, so I’ll see if I can find time tomorrow to install FS9.
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by morbidfred »

Steve I installed FS9 on the 17/11/2019 from the Discs, patched it to 9.1 then switched to the nocd.
There were no problems with the install from memory.

I know this isn't really helpful in solving your problem.
I'm not trying to insult you but have you set it to run as administrator and in compatibility mode ?

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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by TimC340 »

Sadly, the DVD drive I extracted from the back of the computer gubbins cupboard is dead. I shall order a new one, but that'll delay my FS9 experiment by a few days.
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

morbidfred wrote: 23 Dec 2019, 21:59 Steve I installed FS9 on the 17/11/2019 from the Discs, patched it to 9.1 then switched to the nocd.
There were no problems with the install from memory.

I know this isn't really helpful in solving your problem.
I'm not trying to insult you but have you set it to run as administrator and in compatibility mode ?

Gav
Gav,
That is in no way insulting. It is a close enough date to be the case but can you confirm that you are on Windows 10 1909 and that it was a clean 1909 install?
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by morbidfred »

Hi Steve,

I've just checked and I think my usefulness is about to expire.
winver is currently 1903 - the original install is from an old win10 usb stick installer.

Sorry :/
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

OK so your install was a fresh install of 1903, is that correct?

If so then that is interesting as I know that secdrv was not installed in W10 so I am wondering how you managed to install and load up the game.
My next thing is why the fs9.1 update will not run.

I shall keep trying various things but the bottom line I keep coming back to is that the hardware has not changed since before the Acronis wipe incident. I am struggling at the moment to understand what could possibly be wrong. I have checked by hardware and there is nothing that does not have an active driver. The problem is the fluctuating results, I get with everyhing I try.
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by morbidfred »

I believe that to be correct v1903.

However now I am curious also.
When you asked for secdrv.sys v4.3.86.0 I pulled it from the old win8 machine as per your request. I have just checked the pc that fs9 is installed on and it indeed has secdrv.sys but it is v3.18.0.0 (running win10). Would you like a copy of it ?
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

Ahhh that is in fact there to fool people. I have it also but what it is is the mechanism to block it rather than a different version to allow it to run.
Crafty buggers. I did read up on it and that is why I asked for the Win8/8,1 version as it was the last to work.

Thanks for your help. Will try out various things over the next couple of day as the missus is with her mother in Bournemouth, so plenty of time to play around.
Steve
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Re: Windows 10 file need

Post by Firebird »

Gents,
Thanks for your support over this vexing time. I have an update.

Firstly, I discovered that I had 3 problems.
Firstly, the inability to install FS9 under, at the very least, a new Windows 10 install.

Secondly, the inability to recover my game from the backups that I had of my F: (FS9) drive and S: (Scenery) drive plus the backups from user/documents and user/appdata folders.

Finally, the inability to get a working system using a fresh saved FS9.1 install that I prepared the last time that I reinstalled - taking into account the first problem.

I decided to skip the clean install and work on that later, if needed, and concentrate on the two backups that I had.
I also decided to concentrate on the saved clean FS9.1 install as this at least started up OK in its vanilla state.

Over the last couple of days I have been trying to update the vanilla install in small steps to identify where it was going wrong.
As many of you will know I use Procmon as a tool to diagnose any problems. I should state that one this occassion it was of no use other than to say that a device was unavailable/driver needed updating although it did not tell me which drive nor driver.

So back to step by step testing.
To cut a long story short, I eventually narrowed it down to one file in one scenery, out of 715 folder entries, that was the cause of the hang. What was doubling annoying was that it is one promoted on our site and I also did some testing of it for the author, so i know that it used to work.

Once that file was removed from the scenery.cfg path then everything came up fine.
I have contacted the author about the file and scenery to see if the file is necessary and if so see about a replacement. So there should be something about that on the support thread in due course.

So once I had the heavily modified vanilla install working I removed the problem file in the original installation drive. I still got the device driver issue. Somewhere out of left field it occurred to me that the issue might be the symlinks that I use in the FS9\scenery folder to point to the actual scenery In the S:FS9_scenery folder.
Now this explanation might sound a bit too technical for some, and not accurate enough for others, but here goes.
What i though was that behind the scenes the symlinks actually used the system level GUID addresses of the F: partition in the pointers. As I had altered the size and position of the partitions I thought that maybe the symlinks were now incorrect.

So deleted the symlinks on the F: drive and set them up again to the S: scenery folders.
Hey presto! My old installation minus that one problem file now works with the origin backed up FS9 and Flight Simulator Files folders copied across.

So there we have it. The cause and the solution to all problems. The outstanding question is why the file did not use to cause a problem and now does.

One other thing that people should be aware of.
When you installed Win 7, 8 or Vista you used to state what your logonid would be. Most of us chose our own Christian names.
When you upgraded your installation to later versions that logonid was kept.
However, Win 10 works differently. It stores your license key with your mandatory ms email account. If you then install from scratch the installation no longer asks you for a logonid. It automatically assigns one to you as the first 5 characters. This can be a real pain in the ass if you use things like OneDrive as it automatically assigns the new logonid to your email account and can cause all sorts of issues if you want to set the name of the logonid back to what it was.
If you upgraded to 10 from a previous versions it does still keep your old logonid. The problem only occurs with a clean install.

To most people it might not be a big thing but you should be aware of it. For example I had to alter the FS9.cfg was pointing to :-
SITUATION=C:\Users\stevei\Documents\Flight Simulator Files\default and I had to point it to :-
SITUATION=C:\Users\harli\Documents\Flight Simulator Files\default to avoid an error and the less of default settings on startup.

Sorry to bore most of you but it might be useful to some.

I may very well try to install a clean FS9 from disks once I have tidied everything up and got my equilibrium back.
I will let you know how that goes.
Steve
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