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Flickering scenery textures

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Greg
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Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

One of the side effects of converting John Stinstrom's scenery objects to P3Dv4 was the heavy flickering of decal textures such as insigna, doors and windows. This was the result of a change in the z-bias behaviour since FSX.

After much reading and testing I seem to have found a solution for this issue by using negative z-bias values on the decal textures, a feature introduced in P3Dv2. It works on my system but I'd like to find a few volunteers who want to test this.

Testing is simple: you need to have Europe and/or North America installed via Matrix. Start P3Dv4 and have a look at the current version of LICZ Sigonella and/or KSZL Whiteman, two sceneries by John notorious for their flickering.

Then download the attached zip file and replace the bgl files in "MAIW_EUROPE\MAIW_EUROPE_OBJECTS\Scenery" for the Sigonella library and/or "MAIW_NA\MAIW_NA_OBJECTS\Scenery" for the Whitman library and have another look at these two bases. The decal flickering should be gone.

Please report back with your findings. Thanks
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Foxbat
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Foxbat »

Sigionella was bad. With the new files, perfect, no flickering at all. At Whiteman the result is also better, but there is still flickering at the Operations Center building and a couple of others. Good that this can be solved!
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Greg
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

Thanks Andrew. I forgot to mention that the new files will only affect the objects in those libraries, obviously. If the scenery has objects from the global object libraries (like ABO) then those will still flicker.

If the results are positive for everyone, then I'll recompile all the John Stinstrom libraries and provide them in region updates.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by bvanhout »

Hi Greg,

A definite improvement to both sceneries. No flickering at all on the libraries modified.

Great work.

One suggestion on Whiteman, can the "2D images" of the security towers, which are only visible from one side, be changed with those same objects from the ABO file.

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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by ejoiner »

Hi I am glad to see this. I just installed Matrix after a fresh install of P3D 4.3. I noted that after installing global libraries and North America MAIW only, I have some flickering buildings in KVPS Eglin. I havent flown more than around there. But several buildings have flickering. Hoping you guys are on to something and that it will get fixed.

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Greg
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

bvanhout wrote: 17 Sep 2018, 00:04 One suggestion on Whiteman, can the "2D images" of the security towers, which are only visible from one side, be changed with those same objects from the ABO file.
I'll see what I can do.
ejoiner wrote: 19 Sep 2018, 03:01 Hoping you guys are on to something and that it will get fixed.
If I get enough confirmations that my method fixes the z-fighting of decal textures, then I'm certain that it can be applied to all sceneries that use them.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by petebramley »

Hi Greg

I have finally got around to installing Matrix Europe and can confirm that once I had made the patch the flickering is gone. Obviously still there on the Pratica Di Mare Mil scenery as that has not been patched.

One question, if I amend an AFD file within the Matrix folder (i.e. LIRE_ADEP4_JS.bgl) will that be overwritten in any upcoming updates ? Also I have removed some of the RAF Typhoon/Hawk paints/Traffic files as I have more recent examples, so same question will they be re-installed with any future updates to Matrix ?

Now about to tackle North America !
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Firebird »

In simple terms if you have amended files in their matrix folders and updates come with files of the same name then yes they will get overwritten.
In this case what you need to do is create a new folder(s) and make it active, with a higher layer number than the Matrix folders and therefore you amendments will supercede the matrix files in those circumstances.

... or at least this is what you would do with FS9/FSX. Whether or not that is the case for P3D I would have to defer to Greg.
It maybe that Greg may have to create a Matrix Override folder as part of Matrix so that instead of amending files you copy them to the override folder and amend them there.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by petebramley »

I was afraid that may be the case but will see what Greg says.
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Greg
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

Hi Pete. That's a yes to all your questions. Matrix can't take your custom setup into account for updates.

You could follow the adivese in chapter 8 of the Matrix manual but I admit it's a bit cumbersome. However what Steve said is interesting. Right now, there's no way to play with folder layering so that custom stuff gets a higher priority than the stuff in Matrix, but I will look into creating an "override" folder structure where one can simply drop things that never get overwritten. Not sure if it's even possible by simply using the SDK or if I'd have to write my own code to process the files, but it would solve a lot of issues for people like you with a custom setup.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by petebramley »

Cheers Greg

Was thinking of following ch8 and sorta cherrypick the updated stuff I need. Folder layering sounds too much like hard work and I certainly don't want to distract you from getting the Matrix out for the default setup users. After re-reading chapter 8 that looks the most sensible path to take. Tks guys
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by bvanhout »

Hi Pete,

It might seem like a bit of work but I have created a "update" folder with all the files I have changed in Matrix. after a Matrix update I simply copy my files back into Matrix. It seems to have worked well so far.

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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by a320skipper »

Hi Greg,

your flickering fix is fantastic! Keep up the good work!

Cheers
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by PlaneCpt »

Hi

I didn't get the info where I can find this patch. Just tried out Matrix and Pratica Di Mare has flickering hangar textures. Any hint?
Thanx in advance.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

Hi. Please read the first post of this thread. This is still in a testing phase but will be rolled out soon.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Arkanoid »

Congratulations Greg, it works for NAS Sigonella scenery. Looking forward for the definitive version.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by PlaneCpt »

Arkanoid wrote: 04 Oct 2018, 18:58 Congratulations Greg, it works for NAS Sigonella scenery. Looking forward for the definitive version.
So, either Sigonella didn't have the issue in the first place, or a recent Matrix update contained the fix.
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Re: Flickering scenery textures

Post by Greg »

Sigonella was included as test case in the first post.

The fix is now also available through a region update in Matrix.
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