comm frequencies and ai traffic behaviour

[hawk_sh]

I have an odd problem with my Kliniska highway strip scenery. (http://www.militaryaiworks.com/forums/18/15954)

When flying a user aircraft I noticed that I could not communicate with the tower.
I had not added a frequency yet.
However in the communication menu I could select the airport and the tower in the nearest airports list.
By default it showed a frequency of 122.900 for the tower.
The submenues were empty though, there were no messages to transmit.

Then I added a tower frequency in Airport Design Editor.
Now I was able to communicate with the tower (taxi, takeoff, landing clearance...) and I could hear the radio messages of the AI aircraft.
But on the other hand the AI traffic did not take off anymore. The AI aircraft taxi to the hold short point, stay there and disappear after a few minutes.
As soon as I remove the tower frequency the AI traffic will take off again.

I tried to add a tower frequency 122.900 (the one that is shown when no frequency is assigned) but it is the same, no AI take offs.

Also when I for example add a tower frequency of 136.375 the menu still shows 122.900 but there are messages to transmit and I can hear my radio calls but the tower does not answer. The AI traffic behaves correctly.

I already tried at least ten different frequencies and types but without success.

Whenever I can communicate with the tower from a user aircraft the AI traffic does not take off.
When the AI traffic takes off I cannot communicate.

The scenery was made from scratch, there is no stock airport, so no data was imported.

Any ideas?

[clickclickdoh]

Couple of questions:

1) When the aircraft are taxiing to the runway, do you hear them ask for and receive take off permission, then not go? Or, do they taxi up silent and sit there?

If they are being cleared for take-off but not going, check to make sure that your runway object and runway line match. I had one where the runway object was 09/27 and the runway line was 27/09. Very frustrating trying to find that.

If they are not being cleared, check for a stuck AI plane slowly flying around the area. I have had busted TnG flight plans where they will fly around with the gear out real slow and never come to the airport... and nothing takes off at the airport because the stuck plane was cleared to land.

If neither of those turn up anything, I'd switch the tower to CTAF and see what happens. That should remove most of the tower controls FS9 uses. If the problem still persists with CTAF, it is most likely an AFCAD or traffic problem.

[hawk_sh]

Thanks for your reply, just tried several things, here is the summary:

case 1)
tower frequency in ADE 136.375
communication menu shows 122.900, no messages to transmit in menues
I can hear AI traffic making radio calls
there are no answers from the tower
AI traffic will take off

case 2)
tower frequency in ADE 129.900
communication menu shows 129.900, there are messages to transmit in menues
I can hear myself making radio calls and tower answers
I can hear AI traffic making radio calls and tower answers (taxi to departure).
There is no takeoff clearance from the tower for the AI aircraft
AI will not take off

case 3)
CTAF tower frequency in ADE 129.900
communication menu shows 129.900, no messages to transmit in menues
I can not hear any AI traffic making radio calls
AI traffic will take off


My runway is 08/26, the taxi link is R08, that is the primary runway.

As mentioned above, when I remove any frequency, the AI traffic will take off.

[clickclickdoh]

It almost sounds to me like there might accidentally be two versions of the AFCAD working from different developmental stages, so it gets confused on which tower frequency to use... especially with it taking off under CTAF but not under tower control. The fact that you can't see or hear messages with CTAF tells me that some other frequency is being used. Try opening the map, clicking on the airport and seeing what frequency it is using.

[hawk_sh]

There is always only one AFCAD at a time.
In the map it shows the frequency I set in ADE and that is also shown in the communication menu: 129.900

[clickclickdoh]

If you fly away from the airport, does the radio option to switch to approach/departure/area control show up in the communication menu, and are they talking?

[Firebird]

Well the problem is afcad related. Not exactly sure what but the key thing here is that when you have a freq, i.e. control, it doesn't work. I would check out the afcad for errors, like hold short line too far from the runway.

The reason it works without a freq is that the rules are different. If you can't find the problem pm the afcad and I will see if I can get it to work.

[hawk_sh]

If you fly away from the airport, does the radio option to switch to approach/departure/area control show up in the communication menu, and are they talking?

When I fly away i can switch to Warzaw Center and I can radio messages to them and they will answer both when I use a tower or a CTAF frequency.

Thanks Firebird.
I will check the hold shorts points

[hawk_sh]

Problem solved !!

Thanks for the tip regarding the hold shorts.

While the runway taxi link was well within the hold short limits my runway itself was not.

Because of the runway width of only 1m and the grey color of the runway in ADE on a grey apron completely surrounding this runway it was "invisible" on my screen.

So the obvious is not obvious when not visible...

[Firebird]

Glad you got it sorted.

[hawk_sh]

Well, now that the communication is working properly I discovered the next issue that seems to be specific to certain AI aircraft.

I have made my flightplans so that AI fighter aircraft will depart in groups of two or four aircraft.
What I am observing now with the AI Su-22s is that the first aircraft will take off but the second one will line up on the runway and stay there until it disappears after a few minutes. I seems that the second aircraft does not get takeoff clearance.
In groups of four aircraft the first one takes off, second one disappears after some minutes, third one disappears, fourth one takes off after the previous two have disappeared.

However when I assign exactly the same flightplans to the HTAI F-16s or the SBAI Mig-29s all aircraft will take off properly.

Could it be that the Su-22s are slower than the F-16s or Mig-29s and that when the second aircraft is supposed to receive takoff clearance it does not because the first aircraft is still too close to the runway?