Military AI Works

Hi,

For quite a while now, I have been following development ( or lack of it ! ) of the MSFS20 AI system.
I think it is fair to say, this is one area that needs much attention.

Things are hopefully about to change for the better, as we now have a Community Member, Kai P Kamjunke of the Alpha India Group ( Kaiii3 on MSFS Forum ) with direct access to the Asobo / MS development team.
Discussion has already taken place, addressing some of the core issues with the MSFS AI system.

After messaging Kai myself, he was certainly aware of all of the issues that I had witnessed, during the testing of “ Offline “ AI Traffic a while back. He was able to confirm that it would be the “ Core “ MSFS2020 AI Engine that is being looked at first. Further Traffic related issues after that and over the longer term.
When I asked him if we would be likely to see any changes to the AI System in the next SIM update on the 27th of this month, he said that was probably unlikely due to the fact that the emphasis of this update is “ Performance “.

Will keep you updated,


Pete Beeby.

Interesting. I am watching this keenly with respect to AI ship traffic as well.

…following on from my initial Post regarding this subject, for those of you interested, you can read more on the developments here -

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/im ... aig/377764

Pete.

I read that thread that you provided and as far as i can see there is very little info there. There is a lot of requests, a lot of statements about what should be done and some arguing about who was a proper partner to help in this area.

I also read the article about FLAi. I will admit that I had not even heard of the group until now. What I did find surprising was the quote attributed to AIG that FLAi was a ‘conduit towards using work without permission'. I seem to recall that this was part of the issue that we had with an AIG tool a few months ago.

My take on the AI issue is that the system must be open for third parties.The most effective design should involve organisations and individuals that have spent nearly two decades producing and supporting AI - nobody knows the capabilities and pitfalls like them. The design needs to be completed, signed off, coded, tested and a fully documented SDK released before any meaningful AI can be produced.
No business will never be able to provide the AI coverage and standard that several freeware agencies can.

..that's a real shame Steve, I guess I haven't made myself clear enough for the reason for posting.
Can I just say that, I have no interest in AIG and I have never installed one of their products in any of my Flight Simulators.

The reason for posting was just to point out, the link we now have between a Community Member (Kai Kamjunke) and Asobo/Microsoft, to hopefully sort out all the issues with the current state of the MSFS2020 AI Engine.
I think it is simply wishful thinking, that Microsoft is going to hand this over to a third party in its entirety, its also just very
unlikely that this is going to happen.

The link included statements from Kai, mentioning discussion/s that he had already had with Jorge (Microsoft) and so on.
I appreciate that not much information was given regarding any progress, but at least we have someone who is experienced in the
development of AI, actively engaged in dialogue with the Asobo/Microsoft development team.
We simply must now be in a better position than we were a few months back, that's all I am trying to say.


Kind Regards,

Pete.

Pete, yes I got that. There has been communication but nothing more than that - as far as we know.

As for AIG I was not insinuating that you were working as an agent for them. I was attempting to be even handed and not come down on any one thought as to the demise of FLAi. My reasoning here is simply that I just don't know enough to make up my mind. The only comment I made was surprise at the quote attributed to them. Nothing else should be inferred from that.

I did read through it all to see if there was any useful info there but my analysis is that what it boils down to is someone posted their thoughts on a subject. Not that the thought was unreasonable, it is then followed by people posting their thoughts and a bit of minor mud-slinging ensued.

I would agree that talks with an org that knows the subject is a good thing. Of course, unless the knowledge transfer is accepted and used or assistance offered and accepted then it really is nothing more than an exploration exercise.

I wasn't advocating that anything be outsourced by Asobo, although a couple of things now have - including helos, more that the final implementation needs to be freely accessible for anybody wanting to add AI.
I think it is unreasonable to expect a business to pay for resources and then assign them full time to something that will not bring any revenue in. The only exception to this would be that they monetize AI somehow. From what they are providing so far, and announced, I do not see this happening.

I hope I haven't disappointed you too much with my comments.

…not at all Steve, we’re all adults here aren’t we !!

If Asobo are getting advice from Kai, that can only be a good thing. As he implies in the thread, there's a lot to do to make the MSFS AI system fit for purpose, and it's only when that's done that third-party developers can exploit it to populate the sim with realistic, viable traffic. I don't think there's any suggestion that third parties 'take over' the AI system, but it may be that Asobo can apply Kai's advice to move the AI system on from what we have now.

From this video it seems the AI behaviour doesn't always work well.

That's AI control of flyable aircraft, an option available while you're flying so that you can go and watch yourself from various viewpoints. It's not (yet) very good. It is not the AI system used for AI traffic. That said, AI behaviour in FS9/X/P3D isn't always sensible!