Hey there. We need your help to keep our servers running.
Please consider making a donation using the PayPal QR code or button at the bottom of this page. Thanks!

Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Let's hear all about the eye candy at those military bases.
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

I rarely post on MAIW but I'm a long time reader and user. I hope I'm posting in the right forum...

Does anyone have any idea how to get AI to show up at KNIP in 5.2? I'm using ORBX's True Earth Florida, with a modified ADE to give AI parking, yet I cannot get any fixed wing aircraft to show up. I've tried multiple variations of ADE's (some found on here, some found on AVSIM), converted for p3d, yet none have had any luck. I've also watched AI enroute to KNIP just flat out disappear when they get on approach.

As an aside, I just brought the MAIW NIP0 ADE in and modified it to work on the above mentioned platform with great success! Looks superb actually. To rule that out as a culprit, no, the issue with no fixed wing AI existed before bringing in NIP0. And, with the helos working on the airport itself, that rules out an errant FS9 traffic file.

Either way, I'm pulling my hair out trying to figure it out. If anyone has any insight on how to get this to work or has seen how to fix it themselves, I'd love to hear from ya! Thanks in advance!!
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

I have the same problem, and have had for some considerable time so I haven't looked at it for a while! On top of that, the sim will not take you to KNIP in the Tower Controller position - it will always take you to NIP0. I suspect there is something in the original file, or a nearby airport file, that's preventing P3Dv5 from recognising it as a usable airport, but I haven't found out what it is.

I did completely rebuild the airfield in ADE and compiled it for P3Dv4 some time ago, but it made no difference.

Edit: correction, I compiled it for P3Dv5.

Further edit: SuperTrafficBoard shows several arrivals from and departures to KNIP at Cecil (P8As), but right-clicking on those flights shows 'AI Unavailable', even though they are in the sim. STB does not recognise KNIP, despite the amount of traffic that is scheduled there (yes, I've rerun MakeRunways!).
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

On further investigation, deleting the KNIP and NIP0 add-ons and going back to stock scenery reveals that the runways don't appear. Trying the Tower view puts me at 0N 0W. I've tried building a new AFD on the stock P3Dv5 KNIP and injecting it as an add-on airport, and again no runways appear (and there are none in the map or Go To Airport dialogue). The runways appear ok in ADE and I can't find any obvious problems with it, but there is definitely an issue with that location in-sim.
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

Thanks for looking at it!! Yeah, I think this is something beyond the ADE with all of the above being observed. It's almost like it's a bug in the underlying architecture of the program. It's at least nice to know I'm not the only one having this issue.
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

OK, I've sorted it to some extent. The bug (in my system) stopping the stock airport from working was an ALT file associated with the JS airport. I'm not sure when that ALT file was generated. However, I did a quick-and-dirty mod to the stock AFD and got traffic working just fine. I've attached the file for you to use as the basis of a new AFD to go under the JS scenery, but note that it's not geographically aligned either with reality or with the JS scenery so you'll have to play with that. The parking isn't ordered nor is there a sufficiency of it for all the traffic files you could potentially use with it, so it would need a lot of work to be a convincing substitute for the ADE9 file that came with the original JS scenery.

I may have a look at doing that in the next few weeks, but if you want to try it yourself, feel free!

Image
Attachments
KNIP2_ADEP5_TJC.bgl
(34.08 KiB) Downloaded 7 times
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

Hey any little bit helps! Thanks! I was never able to use the JS scenery (that was the scenery from FS9, right?) so I've just been using a modified ADE from ORBX True Earth Florida. I wonder if I can get this to work with that...? Where was that ALT file located that you're referring to? I'm curious if it's in my system as well...
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

I think it was from a mod to the JS scenery I did myself for P3Dv4. If you have it, or anything like it, it'll be in P3Dv5\Scenery\World\Scenery.

I don't have TE Florida, but usually their airfields are modifications of the stock airport - but you'll have to either substitute a new KNIP file using their naming format within the TE Florida folder structure (it'll be in Orbx\Orbx Library\P3Dv5\TrueEarth Florida\ORBX\FTX_NA\FTX_FL_!NAFL!_05_Scenery\), or disable their files and use your own in Addon Scenery or via Lorby's Addon Organiser in an XML file.

I just noticed that there's no hold short on the new taxiway by the 9 threshold - that'll end up with aircraft not getting airborne. Try this one...
Attachments
KNIP2_ADEP5_TJC.bgl
(36.91 KiB) Downloaded 10 times
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

That absolutely did it! I had an ALT file in there as well from ORBX TE FL that I disabled and now your file is working! It's ironic that I cannot seem to get my own modification to work though. And, I'll tell you, that alt file was totally needed because there are some issues with elevation. I'll experiment with it as well and see what I can get. JS's stuff was the original FS9 scenery for KNIP, right?
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

Yes, that's right. I did have it working in P3Dv4, but not in v5. It's an excellent scenery for its time but the Z-fighting in the textures is a bit distracting. The airfield has changed quite a bit since John made that scenery. I understand that we have permission to modify and update his stuff as necessary under the MAIW banner, and of course you can do whatever you like to it for your own use, so you can run the scenery library through MCX to update it to P3Dv4.4 compatibility, which will work for v5. However, it's geolocked - though that can be edited in MCX - and the position is slightly out for the real airfield. Ironically - and unusually - the stock airport in P3Dv5 is in almost exactly the right position, but it is in the out-of-date layout.

Now you've piqued my interest, and I've just finished a major project (that should be available very soon), I might well have a play with it this weekend. I've already downloaded a photoreal background via SBuilderX. I think John Young's traffic file (Traffic_Florida_P3s_P8s_JYAI) needs a bit of an update, as it looks like there are too many P3s in it - and probably not enough P8s - for the 2021 situation, but it makes for a fairly busy picture when combined with his H-60s at NIP0. If you add JSs lovely rendition of Cecil, put some parking at Mayport, and activate Whitehouse NOLF, you can have a very active USN scene in the area!
User avatar
Victory103
Colonel
Colonel
Posts: 3880
Joined: 13 Aug 2007, 03:35
Version: P3D
Location: KPHX

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by Victory103 »

Need to re-look over my v4.5 install. I was stationed there and both Whitehouse and Mayport can get busy with helo traffic. All the older squadrons, including mine, have moved to NS Norfolk since. I've tried to keep my Florida Orions/P8 traffic file updated as the P-3s retire, but the P-8s are passed around for deploying VP squadrons.
DUSTOFF
ARMY PROPS
NAVY SAR

-Chris
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

Hi Tim!

All good info. I might be a bit busy the next few weeks/months to try to do all of that as I might be transitioning to a new airframe at work. MAYBE. Ha! And I'm moving. I was sitting in the back today heading home from a trip and fiddled around with what you sent yesterday. I'd agree that there might be out of date P3s and I DARE SAY Sea Kings flying around the JAX area. LOLOLOLOL! Do those even fly anymore?? Either way, I doubt a lot of those P3s are still flying TBH. I'd be curious to see what has transitioned to P8s...

Sadly I'd love to do that model converter you mentioned but I have NO IDEA how to. I'd love to see what it could do tho. To be frank, or Russ I suppose, I'm just happy having AI back at KNIP. Activating Whitehouse NOLF? I'm unfamiliar. You've peaked my interest. If I get to sit down again in the next day or so, I'll have a look.

I don't see an easy way to attach files. I'd love to attach what I did today so maybe you, or someone else desperate to get this place kinda working again, will have something to work from. How would I attach on here?
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

Got them, KC10. I'll have a look at them over the weekend. I've progressed mine a fair bit, and moved NIP0 so it's in the right place. There are definitely too many P3s going on here!

There's an MAIW traffic file for Mayport, but it's compiled for a separate helo airport (0NRD, I think) which is not really necessary any more, so I've swapped all references to 0NRD to KNRD and just splatted a load of parking on the stock airport (with reference to Google Earth). There's a decent freeware Whitehouse (KNEN) on Avsim or Simviation, but I don't think any of the MAIW traffic uses it. I've bent a couple of the P-8 plans into it for now to give it something to do. I might have a look at John's paintkit for the P-8 and see if my artistry is up to repainting some to bring the fleet a bit more up to date.

MCX is hugely capable, but to do conversions of bgl files from FS9 format to FSX or P3D is very easy indeed. It's all covered in the manual and online help, and if you have any questions Arno is always willing to help over at FSDeveloper.

Good luck with the conversion to the new type! I've left all that behind now; I just converted to the A350 as Covid hit, and I took retirement rather than hang around to see what was going to become of the industry, so I never flew the thing.
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

Glorious plane and congrats on retirement! I think the one job (of two) let too many go into retirement too early and it's biting us hard with schedules falling apart due to manning. The next few weeks promise to be a nightmare; I hope I don't get caught in it. With the other job, the airframe is retiring and I'm faced with either retiring OR transitioning. I still don't know what I want to do. lol!

I'll take a look at the FSD stuff. That could be interesting.
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

Progress:

Image

Image

Yes, there are some untextured buildings - I've edited one of JS's model files to represent the current layout. I've created a background in SBX, but it needs a bit of TLC. The combination of current background and JS scenery looks ok if you don't look too close! It'll do for an area I'm not likely to visit too much. If anyone wants the ADEP5 file for the airfield layout (no background or models), it's attached. I can't attach the NIP0 file as it's not my original work.
Attachments
KNIP2_ADEP5_TJC.bgl
(62.46 KiB) Downloaded 13 times
KC10Pilot
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Posts: 28
Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 20:53

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by KC10Pilot »

Look at you Mr Talent! Nicely done sir!
User avatar
petebramley
MAIW Developer
MAIW Developer
Posts: 1470
Joined: 17 Jun 2007, 16:05
Version: P3D
Location: EGBG

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by petebramley »

Looking very good. I always had problems with KNIP in my P3Dv4.4 and eventually the only way I could get AI to show was to amend the default airport. Is there any chance of doing a version for 4.4 ?
Pete B
Retired and busier than ever !!
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

Pete, the v5 AFD I posted above should work for v4.4 if you import it into ADE and recompile for that sim. As you found, it's a modification of the stock AFD. It's not complete, and some of the parking is more than a little speculative. Actually, I can do that later today and post it here. I'm happy to share the photoreal background, but that's a 25mb+ file so can't be shared here. I'll have a think about how best to do that. There is an issue with the AFD in that some of the runway markings and textures intermittently disappear. It's a well-reported P3D problem, and not one I have time or the inclination to tackle right now.

I didn't really want to go down the rabbit hole of rebuilding the full airfield, as bringing the JS scenery up to date and tackling the texture issues to get rid of the z-buffer flickering is a fairly major project - though one that would have knock-on benefits for updating the whole JS oeuvre! But, having (I hope) just finished a fairly big project for JY I need to spend some time on IRL stuff before I go back to 12-hour days on the computer! I'll have a play next week to get the one JS mdl I edited (to remove now demolished hangars) back into the Jacksonville Scenery Library and thus textured, and if the consensus is that it's morally acceptable, I'll submit it for the Hangar sometime before Christmas.

I have a load of updated JS stuff which I did for JY's Typhoon project which also ought to be shared...
User avatar
petebramley
MAIW Developer
MAIW Developer
Posts: 1470
Joined: 17 Jun 2007, 16:05
Version: P3D
Location: EGBG

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by petebramley »

Cheers Tim. It sounds as if you went the same way as I did to get something working at KNIP so your version will not be that different from mine (Although probably much nicer). Please don't go out of your way for what is effectively a non-issue.

Rgds
Pete B
Retired and busier than ever !!
User avatar
gsnde
MAIW Staff
MAIW Staff
Posts: 4075
Joined: 05 Apr 2007, 08:13
Version: P3D
Location: South-West Germany
Contact:

Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by gsnde »

Tim, make the package including all files and send it to me. I will add it to the download section.

Oh, and please write the note for the download… :smt001

From mobile hence short
Cheers,
Martin
________________________________________
The Owl's Nest * Military Aircraft Reference * ICAO Reference * Distance Calculator * MAIW, Military AI & UKMil Reference
User avatar
TimC340
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 883
Joined: 07 Mar 2015, 13:18
Version: P3D
Location: Hadleigh, Suffolk

Re: Navy Jacksonville (KNIP) no AI in P3D 5.2

Post by TimC340 »

Thanks Martin, I will - but it may be a little while before I can do that.

Pete, I just tried recompiling for v4 and it didn't work. It looks like there are differences in the airspace and navaids in v5 that mean that it needs a bit more thinking about! I will do that, and I can remake the AFD from scratch if necessary as it'll work for everything from FSX to P3Dv4.5, but given that Martin wants it for the Hangar I'll take a bit of time and get it a bit more production-ready!
Post Reply