Military AI Works

some ideas about the model (xml tricks), and FDE:

the landing behaviour is very fine and looks realistic.

Starting could be improved if the xml code could encrease the "invisible gear" continously...

At the moment is looks like going up several feet and starting like a STOL aircraft on invisible extended landing gears.

I dont know if it is possible in the xml code, but it would be a great improvement.

Anyway, many thanks for your great work!

I really don't understand the term ""increase the invisible gear continuously" or "invisible extended landing gears" Guenther. There has to be a small STOL element because immediately the animated lift begins, the FDE accelerates the aircraft forward.

To make any changes now, even if I knew what was needed, would require re-animating in 7 LODs x 17 models x 2 sim versions = 238 animation changes. That's probably around 50 hours of repetitive and tedious work, including re-testing. That's not something I'm prepared to do.

John

Guenther, the models are limited by the actual AI engine itself and how it handles AI traffic. It was never meant to allow helicopters as AI traffic with true vertical takeoffs and landings.

What you see in John's model is the best we can do given the limitations of the AI engine.

And it's pretty goddamned awesome.


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John Young wrote:I really don't understand the term ""increase the invisible gear continuously" or "invisible extended landing gears" Guenther. There has to be a small STOL element because immediately the animated lift begins, the FDE accelerates the aircraft forward.

To make any changes now, even if I knew what was needed, would require re-animating in 7 LODs x 17 models x 2 sim versions = 238 animation changes. That's probably around 50 hours of repetitive and tedious work, including re-testing. That's not something I'm prepared to do.

John

Blame it on my poor English...


These starts look like the helicopter is moving some meters vertical (by xml animation) and then roll on an "invisible landing gear" until the necessary speed for takeoff is reached.

I know your excellent Harriers (VTOL ) at ETUO Gutersloh and the CH-47Ds of Desmond Burrell.
So I suppose the animations of the Jayhawks work similary.

If a 45 degree (f.e.) start is not possible with FS AI engine (and all is based on Stemme motor glider?),
perhaps some more meters vertical would look even better?

I fully understand that it is unrealistic to change all these models and I am very happy to get your jayhawks.
(I replaced my hovercontrol jayhawks at KECG). So take all as just some (maybe silly) thoughts...

The payware "Heli Traffic 2009" seems to work quite different?

If you read the manual Guenther. It explains how the animation works. The aircraft is still on the visible runway during the take-off roll. It's just that the animation has lifted the whole model by 10ft and added the tilt. The contact points in the FDE are still at ground level - there is no "invisible landing gear". The aircraft takes about 12 degrees to transition from the start of the lift to "level" flight:



The value of the transition angle is determined by the speed of the lift and the FDE pulling the aircraft forward. I can speed up the animation to get the aircraft to 10 ft more quickly and so beat the FDE, but it doesn't look right. I can increase the weight of the aircraft and/or reduce the power of the engines in the FDE so the acceleration is not so great. That will influence the lift angle, but it has dire consequences in other parts of the FDE envelope, particularly the landing.

I did start with a higher lift, but testers here wanted a lower one and I changed it. Rightly so.

Believe me I've wrestled for hours on end with the FDE and the Lift animation. I've watched lots of Black Hawk take-off videos and I'm happy with the result I have. It's not perfect, but the FS9 and FSX AI engines are not designed for helicopters as Mike has already said.

It's the best I can do I'm afraid with the time I'm prepared to give to this.

John

thanks John,

I am sure you are the expert!

Since I watched one of your mdls with ModelconverterX regarding the animations, I know how it works.

Please, go on with such excellent gifts for the FS community!

Greetings from Bavaria

just a small addition:

there is another scenery from you for EG0A:

AFX_Crail_12_fighter.bgl

It should be disabled, I suppose...

EG0A is my AI test airfield. That's the fighter AFCAD from another package, not the 17 helicopter one in the Black Hawk package. Disable or remove whichever one you are not using.

John

Hi John
Excellent job on the models! and Thank You to all for your hard work & contributions!
I was wondering if you have the variant with the nose radar in the works? It is mostly on the export S-70A versions
some examples:

Austria: http://www.airplane-pictures.net/photo/ ... lack-hawk/
Brazil: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Brazil-- ... 1577228/L/
Brunei: http://defence-blog.com/wp-content/uplo ... TUDB_1.jpg
Japan: http://cdn.airplane-pictures.net/images ... 296732.jpg
Jordan: http://www.helis.com/h/h60_jo3002.jpg
Malaysia: http://cdn.airplane-pictures.net/images ... 9/9866.jpg

sorry for being nitpicky

Alas no stafcom. Had you injected these into the topic a few weeks back, I would have considered them. After 17 models and a published zip, I really needed to draw a line and move on.

Sorry about that.

John

Hi,
[originally posted to new thread by mistake - re-posting here now G.C.]

First off, a massive thank you to Mr. Young for the incredible effort in creating all these variations of the Blackhawk family.
Second off, an even bigger thank you for providing them (and all his other creations) in native FSX versions as well as FS9.
Third off, I know it wasn't created for Heli Traffic 2009 and there is no reason to expect it to work (but ...)


Has anyone managed to get the models to work with Heli Traffic 2009 in FSX? I can get the helicopter to appear and lift off and land vertically but the rotors won't turn. I have tried replacing the air and config files with standard Bell 206 copies to see if that helps but it doesn't make any difference.

Does anyone have any advice?

thanks
Gavin

John, I was wondering if you planned on releasing the Firehawk paint kit? CA, NY, NV, OR and FL guard units have kits for at least one per unit.

ahs06 wrote:John, I was wondering if you planned on releasing the Firehawk paint kit? CA, NY, NV, OR and FL guard units have kits for at least one per unit.

Here is the fate of the military firehawks.

OR: 96-26728 Now with CO ARNG in normal configuartion
NY: 91-26328 Still active as of 2012
CA: 83-23871, now with LA ARNG in normal configuartion
NV: 92-26409 Fate unknown

The NV one is definitely still active. The latest bird's eye of RTS shows a tanked bird with the crosses covered up and high visibility bars on the rotors. I'm pretty sure the tanks stay with the unit like MAFFS. I'm assuming the tanks are similar to an L.A. tank which can just be put on and taken off. I'll see what information I can drum up from my fire friends.

That's an interesting development. I'd be happy to modify the model if indeed it has changed recently. I do have a paint kit. I had an e-mail request from someone wanting to do a fictitious paint a few days back, so I put one together for him. I'll send the link to Cick. If anyone else wants it, just PM me with an e-mail address.

John

Update: just realised that I need to apply the mapping changes that I applied to other L-based variants before release if anyone wants to paint anything other than the LA Fire Dept Fire Hawks. I'll do that next.

I think part of the reason there aren't any new pictures of Army Firehawks is twofold. Aero Union, who built the tanks went chapter11 in 2011. The other thing is that a Bambi Bucket carries 660 gallons vs 1,000 gallons but, doesn't require any changes to the airframe. There's a company in Oregon called Simplex Aerospace and they now own the rights to the Firehawk system. There's also a few new civilian Blackhawks going into firefighting in the near future. Here's a video from 2014 which claims all the tanked units all still active. It is CNN though. http://fireaviation.com/2014/06/27/cnn- ... firehawks/

Coming soon to sim near you:



From closest to the camera, California, New York, Nevada and Oregon. If anyone can find a serial number for the FL ARNG bird that received the modifications, I'll add it too.

Here's a download link for the 4 Army National Guard Firehawks:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/bn9ma ... ehawks.zip

I bundled in the modified FS9 model John did, so make sure to copy it into the aircraft folder or they won't work right. I included FSX paints to, but don't know how well the unmodified FSX model will work.

This could be cool, learning that AI in FSX can drop objects, so maybe these will actually fight some sim fires.