Problem with Warton AFCAD

[garysted]

Hi,

I'd like to see if I can get any opinions as to why the following is happening if possible please. I'm using the UK2000 Warton scenery (from the Brit Airports release) and am using a AFCAD (can't remember were it came from, but I have modified the parking) like the one shown below. I'm trying to get aircraft to taxi out from the parking on the top left (mainly MAIW BAe jets) and backtrack down the runway and do a 180 on the marked area. At the moment they're backtracking about 2/3rds of the runway length, from the taxiway intersection before doing a 180 on the runway and then departing. As can be seen, there's no link for them to do this. Any ideas very gratefully recieved.



Gary

[Firebird]

Let me see if I understand the problem correctly. The aircraft are parked in the spots marked BAE. They reach the runway and turn right towards the 08 threshold but turn around before they get to the u-turn area that you set up, and take off on 08.

Is this correct?

If it is I have an idea but you need to attach the afcad here so we can look closer.

[Ford Friendly]

I don't know why they would be doing that.

However, you could just add a taxiway link that parallels the portion of the runway you are describing.

Not an elegant solution, but a quick and dirty one.

[KevinJarvis]

I don't know why they would be doing that.

However, you could just add a taxiway link that parallels the portion of the runway you are describing.

Not an elegant solution, but a quick and dirty one.

That's the way I've done it. Works like a charm.

[garysted]

Hi again,

Thanks for the thoughts. I've attached another pic showing the track of the taxying aircraft with a red line, as well as the AFCAD if anybody fancy's a look. I did try putting in a taxi link down the runway already, but then they just turned left at the intersection and launched short from there, or did you mean not to connect it to the runway at the taxiway intersection and run it directly to the overrun at 08 without any other connections? I can see how that would force aircraft to behave how I want on departure but for landing on 08 the aircraft would not be able to turn down the taxiway after backtracking and would need to go back to the threshold at 08 for the taxi link. If that's the only way then I'll go for it, but if anybody has any further ideas I'd be keen to hear them. The annoying part is I have a similar back track set at another UK military field that behaves perfectly, yet appears to be identical in set up. The AI behaviour seems totally unpredictable at times!



Gary

[garysted]

Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 4:22 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi again,

Thanks for the thoughts. I've attached another pic showing the track of the taxying aircraft with a red line, as well as the AFCAD if anybody fancy's a look. I did try putting in a taxi link down the runway already, but then they just turned left at the intersection and launched short from there, or did you mean not to connect it to the runway at the taxiway intersection and run it directly to the overrun at 08 without any other connections? I can see how that would force aircraft to behave how I want on departure but for landing on 08 the aircraft would not be able to turn down the taxiway after backtracking and would need to go back to the threshold at 08 for the taxi link. If that's the only way then I'll go for it, but if anybody has any further ideas I'd be keen to hear them. The annoying part is I have a similar back track set at another UK military field that behaves perfectly, yet appears to be identical in set up. The AI behaviour seems totally unpredictable at times!



Gary

[Firebird]

Gary,
Can I ask what happened before you added the loops at the end of the runway? The reason I ask is that I believe that under FS9 the aircraft will turn around automatically.
The other thing is that I think that you should alter the hold short points in the loop, as it might confuse the situation and cause problems. Nothing should be landing when you're aircraft are on the runway anyway.
One other problem is that the taxiway on the south side closest to the 26 threshold doesn't have a hold short node.

If you need the loops, clear the hold short nodes there.

Now the only thing that I can think of for the early turn around is that there might be a limit for taxying down runways but our LLSD afcad works fine.
The only thing that I can think of that might be causing it is the fact that you have 3 runway nodes close together at that taxiway junction. You don't need them. Leave the middle there and remove the outer ones and reconnect the runway links to the one remaining node.
Its a bit difficult to explain but our LLSD doesn't travel over another runway link node once it enters the runway for taxying, yours does and it might be the difference.

Hopefully I have explained it well enough for you to test out . Let us know how you get on.

[garysted]

Hi again,

I carried out all the corrections listed above (many thanks anyway) without any change in behaviour but then tried a experiment. If the aircraft are consistently doing a 180 at a certain point short of the runway threshold then what would happen if I extended the runway link out, well past the visible threshold - it works! The aircraft turn short of the AFCAD runway link, but directly on the visible threshold. The only strange side effect is the afterburners activate while still taxying downwind to the threshold and switch off before line up - but I can live with that although am curious as to why.

I thought maybe my runway AFCAD was out of alignment but I checked it and it is now off centre, but works fine - odd! Thanks again for the suggestions guys. Just out of interest the runway loops weren't added by me, but came with that AFCAD although I can't remember where it came from.

Gary

[garysted]

Hi again,

I carried out all the corrections listed above (many thanks anyway) without any change in behaviour but then tried a experiment. If the aircraft are consistently doing a 180 at a certain point short of the runway threshold then what would happen if I extended the runway link out, well past the visible threshold - it works! The aircraft turn short of the AFCAD runway link, but directly on the visible threshold. The only strange side effect is the afterburners activate while still taxying downwind to the threshold and switch off before line up - but I can live with that although am curious as to why.

I thought maybe my runway AFCAD was out of alignment but I checked it and it is now off centre, but works fine - odd! Thanks again for the suggestions guys. Just out of interest the runway loops weren't added by me, but came with that AFCAD although I can't remember where it came from.

Gary

[Firebird]

Gary,
I can tell you why the burners light up when they do. They operate on a timing system. When cleared for take off the effect will come into play after a set period and last for a set period.

It may be that you have found the best solution possible for that type of layout.

The only other option that I can think of, with that layout, is going to take a lot of work and even then may not turn out the way you want it to. So I won't go into my theory here.

[garysted]

Steve,

Thanks for all your help, and, as you say, that's probably the best it's going to be. It's always handy to find out these little bits of info, like the burner query. Sorry for all the duplicate posts as well, first posts wouldn't show up until I posted a second for some reason.

Gary