Georgia, assaults S. Ossetia,
- Jumpshot724
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1) In the past year or two Russia nearly quadrupled its military budget
2) They've resumed long range bomber patrols without warning
3) This Georgia conflict
4) Russia adding Poland to their hitlist due to Poland allowing us (the US) to base part of our upcomming missile defense shield
5) Russian airbases are becomming increasingly more active
Great quote from the movie "Dante's Peak"
"If you put a frog in a pot of boiling water, it will jump out. But if you put a frog in cold water and slowly turn the heat up, the frog will boil to death"
Neither one of these actions by Russia alone should cause any alarm, but they've all happened within the past year and a half. One can't help but wonder what's next, and only time will tell....
2) They've resumed long range bomber patrols without warning
3) This Georgia conflict
4) Russia adding Poland to their hitlist due to Poland allowing us (the US) to base part of our upcomming missile defense shield
5) Russian airbases are becomming increasingly more active
Great quote from the movie "Dante's Peak"
"If you put a frog in a pot of boiling water, it will jump out. But if you put a frog in cold water and slowly turn the heat up, the frog will boil to death"
Neither one of these actions by Russia alone should cause any alarm, but they've all happened within the past year and a half. One can't help but wonder what's next, and only time will tell....
-Joe W.
"I love the smell of jetfuel in the morning....smells like VICTORY!!"

"I love the smell of jetfuel in the morning....smells like VICTORY!!"

- VulcanDriver
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Having heard the whole interview given by a Russian General on BBC Radio the other day I think what they actually meant was that in time of all out nuclear war with the US (highly unlikely) the Polish installations would classed as legitimate target. The General added it did not mean that Russia would attack Poland just because it had US assets sited there unless it was all out nuclear war.Jumpshot724 wrote: 4) Russia adding Poland to their hitlist due to Poland allowing us (the US) to base part of our upcomming missile defense shield
He added that the US target potential enemy assets that are not in their enemies countries. Living in the UK that had a lot of US assets based here during the Cold War I grew up in the sure knowledge we were on top of the Soviet hit list.
John
John
"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
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1. Korea - Russian pilots faced US pilots and both shot each other down.
2. Vietnam - same as above.
3. Between 1945 and 1990, over 135 US airmen were shot down - killed and/or captured - by Russian forces responding to intelligence collection "exciter" flights.
4. US trained forces, often with embedded "advisors" faced Russian forces/Russian backed forces in Vietnam, Afghanistan, Latin America, etc. in ground actions that included "advisor" fatalities.
Putin's administrations were always working to restore what had been lost or what had deteriorated ---- something that obviously took years. This is current situation is nothing more than the culmination of events that were largely predictable/foreseeable. Posturing, fear-mongering and alarmism to the contrary, the Russian position is what Putin has pretty much said from the beginning of his rise to power ---> restoring Russia's poistion and prestige on the global stage. Georgian-Russian relations are a tempest in a teapot in comparison to conflicts elsewhere. Its reaction to US-proposed missile basing in Poland is understandable --- how would the UK react if Russia persuaded France to allow the same in France; has anyone forgotten how the US reacted when Russia tried to base missiles in Cuba in the early '60's?
I don't see any evidence that the current situation is any different in terms of "threat" to the post-Cold War situation. Russia understandably declined economically, militarily and politically in power and prestige during and immediately after the collapse of the Soviet Union. To expect that it would accept its "lowered status" on the world stage is, to me, rather illogical.
To believe that the US would go to war with Russia now, or in the forseeable future, is ***to me*** ludicrous. We already played that game - when the stakes were higher and fuses were much shorter - and ***that war*** didn't happen.
2. Vietnam - same as above.
3. Between 1945 and 1990, over 135 US airmen were shot down - killed and/or captured - by Russian forces responding to intelligence collection "exciter" flights.
4. US trained forces, often with embedded "advisors" faced Russian forces/Russian backed forces in Vietnam, Afghanistan, Latin America, etc. in ground actions that included "advisor" fatalities.
Putin's administrations were always working to restore what had been lost or what had deteriorated ---- something that obviously took years. This is current situation is nothing more than the culmination of events that were largely predictable/foreseeable. Posturing, fear-mongering and alarmism to the contrary, the Russian position is what Putin has pretty much said from the beginning of his rise to power ---> restoring Russia's poistion and prestige on the global stage. Georgian-Russian relations are a tempest in a teapot in comparison to conflicts elsewhere. Its reaction to US-proposed missile basing in Poland is understandable --- how would the UK react if Russia persuaded France to allow the same in France; has anyone forgotten how the US reacted when Russia tried to base missiles in Cuba in the early '60's?
I don't see any evidence that the current situation is any different in terms of "threat" to the post-Cold War situation. Russia understandably declined economically, militarily and politically in power and prestige during and immediately after the collapse of the Soviet Union. To expect that it would accept its "lowered status" on the world stage is, to me, rather illogical.
To believe that the US would go to war with Russia now, or in the forseeable future, is ***to me*** ludicrous. We already played that game - when the stakes were higher and fuses were much shorter - and ***that war*** didn't happen.
- VulcanDriver
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What we in the West forget is that Russia (Soviet Union) suffered over 20 million dead in WW2 , the highest of any combatant. I firmly believe that Russia does not want war on that scale again either nuclear or conventional.
John
"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
- Jumpshot724
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Article: "Russia plans to cut military ties with NATO"
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,407321,00.html
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... ttr=797093
Article: "Russia threatens military response if Poland-US missile deal follows through"
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,407262,00.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,407321,00.html
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... ttr=797093
Article: "Russia threatens military response if Poland-US missile deal follows through"
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,407262,00.html
-Joe W.
"I love the smell of jetfuel in the morning....smells like VICTORY!!"

"I love the smell of jetfuel in the morning....smells like VICTORY!!"

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Quote - Only weeks ago, the 18 months of Polish-U.S. missile talks appeared on the verge of collapse(italics added by Ford). The Poles suspended negotiations after the United States refused to meet their demands and public opinion polls found that 70 percent of Poles were against the missile shield on their territory. Poles began protesting the plan.
All that changed on Aug. 8, when Russian armor rolled into Georgia.
"When Russia performs military operations that are perceived as aggressive and brutal, even relatively far from our borders, people in Poland fear," political analyst Grzegorz Kostrzewa-Zorbas told ABC News. (again, italics added by Ford)
"The war in Georgia very quickly and suddenly changed the mood of Poles," Kostrzewa-Zorbas said. "In a week, a strong majority emerged supporting the American missile shield in Poland."
Now, 63 percent support American military presence on Polish soil and feel that the closer ties enhance Poland's security.
The American side also had a large shift in opinion.
"The Americans were unwilling to give Poland any anti-missile and air defense system optimized to defend Polish airspace and territory. They did not want to give Poland Patriot missiles," he said. "Now it is different."
- Endquote
from Russia Makes New Threats Over U.S.-Poland Missile Deal
http://abcnews.go.com/International/Sto ... 271&page=3
As I said before... predictable. Yes the situation appears to be fluid and reactive. The reality is that it's been largely predictable, including the timing of the Russian action in Ossetia. Russian motivation for its actions are definitely understandable - from THEIR perspective and given their history. I didn't say justified - just predictable and understandable.
All that changed on Aug. 8, when Russian armor rolled into Georgia.
"When Russia performs military operations that are perceived as aggressive and brutal, even relatively far from our borders, people in Poland fear," political analyst Grzegorz Kostrzewa-Zorbas told ABC News. (again, italics added by Ford)
"The war in Georgia very quickly and suddenly changed the mood of Poles," Kostrzewa-Zorbas said. "In a week, a strong majority emerged supporting the American missile shield in Poland."
Now, 63 percent support American military presence on Polish soil and feel that the closer ties enhance Poland's security.
The American side also had a large shift in opinion.
"The Americans were unwilling to give Poland any anti-missile and air defense system optimized to defend Polish airspace and territory. They did not want to give Poland Patriot missiles," he said. "Now it is different."
- Endquote
from Russia Makes New Threats Over U.S.-Poland Missile Deal
http://abcnews.go.com/International/Sto ... 271&page=3
As I said before... predictable. Yes the situation appears to be fluid and reactive. The reality is that it's been largely predictable, including the timing of the Russian action in Ossetia. Russian motivation for its actions are definitely understandable - from THEIR perspective and given their history. I didn't say justified - just predictable and understandable.
Russians continue to dig in despite promised Georgia retreat
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080822/D92N9BTG0.html
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080822/D92N9BTG0.html
Russia aims to keep control of Poti
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080823/ap_ ... gia_russia
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080823/ap_ ... gia_russia
Russia recognizes Georgian rebels
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7582181.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7582181.stm
US,and the Russkies anchor military ships in Georgian ports
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080827/D92QQFJ82.html
Got something from Putin
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 622422.ece
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080827/D92QQFJ82.html
Got something from Putin
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 622422.ece
War in Georgia shows Russia a force to be reckoned with
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... =worldwide
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... =worldwide
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- Lieutenant Colonel
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Russia is planning to absorb S. Ossetia
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iUA3 ... AD92RRUHG0
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iUA3 ... AD92RRUHG0
Russia declares that S.Ossetia now a part of Russian territory.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 635843.ece
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 635843.ece
Putin promises an answer to NATO ships
near Georgia
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080902/ap_ ... ia_georgia
near Georgia
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080902/ap_ ... ia_georgia
USN 6th Fleet flagship in Russian controlled Georgian port
http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/ ... 2420080905
Georgia is linked to NATO early warning system.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 678456.ece
http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/ ... 2420080905
Georgia is linked to NATO early warning system.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 678456.ece

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Becuase of the current relations between NATO and Russia, Belgium cancels one of her warships to visit Russia
http://en.rian.ru/world/20080912/116744008.html
http://en.rian.ru/world/20080912/116744008.html

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Things might go downhill in a hurry after several wks of peace
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7651097.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7651097.stm

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Russia has massed 7,000 troops in S. Ossetia.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... refer=home
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... refer=home

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got this from militaryphotos.net
there's fear of a new clash in Abkhazia
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id ... 1&catnum=0
there's fear of a new clash in Abkhazia
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id ... 1&catnum=0

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