A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Discuss anything here...nothing political or controversial please.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

Mike and Sean.

What I mean about being acceptable is this.
My system that I have just replaced used a GTX 970 with 4GB VRAM. This just so happens to be the recommended card by MS. Check on the MS Store page for the system requirements. The minimum requirement is a GTX 770.

Now a ti model does give more performance and it may make up ground on the 970 and will probably overtake the 770.

However, as I detailed elsewhere after SU5 I got some issues - namely the game hung at around 52-53% after clicking on fly. It was 100% repeatable but would only happen at certain airfields, Heathrow, Gatwick, Northolt and Denver being the ones I found very quickly. A side issue was that I got an awful lot of crashes in the World Map if I accidentality pressed the World Map twice in a row, without actually selecting anything.
After various tests I figured out a work around for the troublesome airfields but this plus my mate did not get the same error on a slightly lower spec PC than me seemed to point to a graphics initialisation thing. The one difference on his system was that he had a GTX 1080 Ti.

Eventually MS confirmed that the minimum spec card for the game is now a GTX 1050 ti. This was rather a specific card. When I checked the difference between the 1050 and the 1050 ti the 1050 has 2MB or VRAM and the 1050 ti has 4GB. I asked MS to confirm that the minimum was now a GeForce 10 series card with 4MB of VRAM, due to the architecture but that have so far failed to respond.
Neither has the requirements changed on the page.

It may be that some of what was implemented in SU5 will be either backed out or tuned in SU6. I can't say for certain. All i can say is that in my new system with the rocking horse pooh RTX3080 the airfields load with no issue and I have had no issues with the World Map page.

So what I wrote is not anything that I have read but purely based on my personal experience. My friend has had no such issues with his 1080 Ti and this is why I consider this to be the recommended card.

I hope that clarifies my scribings.

I suspect, but obviously can't prove, that a lot of people that were having crashes after SU5 were falling foul of a change in the graphics system that meant that their GPUs that were fine, according to MS, were now falling behind the drag curve.

To be clear I never ran my general settings above High for the 970 whereas my mate has Ultra for his 1080 Ti.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by SeanG »

I guess what we are really saying is; this sim is somewhat ‘finicky’…

My PC runs fine on well below spec hardware, meanwhile a colleague has issues in the order of magnitude that you describe.

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

Hi Sean,
I don't know for sure but I wouldn't say that it is finicky. It is more likely to be that MS has moved to newer graphics routines that the older cards fall foul of.
I understand what they are doing. They are trying to satisfy the thirst users had had for higher res and at the same time decreasing the performance hit. I don't really have an issue with that. The thing that I have is the lack of openness about it. After all it comes at the time that CPUs and GPUs are in very short supply and you have to pay through the nose for.

Before SU5 I was running the game at Medium with the frames capped at 20, which was about top limit I could get. After SU5, I was running it at High with the frames capped at 30 which it stays more or less at.

A bit more honesty is all i ask for.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by TimC340 »

Damn. MSFS (as well as FSX:SE) is crashing on start up. I don't look at it often, but I wanted to pick up Update 6. Not sure I'll bother, tbh. I can get my fix of nice views of an unmoving but pretty world in Google Earth Pro, and stick with P3D for watching aircraft go by!
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

It is kinda weird. Last week MS Store said that I had a new version of MSFS so I downloaded it. It turned out to be the same version that I already had but it wiped out all my settings. Fortunately, the backup method I described elsewhere meant that it only took 45 mins to get it back up and running.

Yesterday, it said that it it was offline and pointed me to the store which said that it needed to be reinstalled. When I ran it after the download it said a repair was needed. Once that was done everything was fine although I needed to set my usercfg.opt and flightsimulator.cfg back to match my backups.

The MS Store has been weird in the last couple of weeks. Once I found 35 updates. I am wondering if Windows 11 is causing issues with it, as there is a new version of MS Store for 11 (I am still on 10).
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

Just to let people know what is coming in the next update of MSFS, which is SU7/GOTY.

The key thing announced so far is DX12. Now what I have not seen yet is which part of DX12 is being implemented. Some of it now and some of it next year.
I suspect that the first part is the simple switch to the DX12 api from the DX11 api. I say simple switch in a figurative way, it is actually quite a bit of work.
What benefit is there? Simply put moving to the DX12 api will boost the game performance by 20% and will also reduce the CPU load. So anybody struggling to get a constant decent performance at the moment will see a dramatic improvement.

The second part, in 2021, I guess will be a change to utilise Direct Storage. This will only benefit those with a DX12 game plus having the game on an M.2 drive. it will result in a faster loading graphics by utilising the far superior bandwidth oh M.2 drives and be smoother as well.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

Disregard the earlier post, the FPS is not so great when you're running the sim in developer mode. Get out of that and things are normal again. Still learning!
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

I had heard that but have never run it in that mode - yet.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

It's 'interesting' I'll say, there are some fun things you can do with it. I'm sure there are reasons for using it, maybe a year from now AI wise we'll all understand how useful it can be. I was using it for the FPS counter but alas, the mode itself was causing the huge drag on frame rates.

I did just install REX Global Airport Textures and REX Weather Force and those are great additions so far.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

Funny how it handles the aircraft in the boneyard.

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

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MIKE JG wrote: 15 Nov 2021, 21:36 I was using it for the FPS counter but alas, the mode itself was causing the huge drag on frame rates.

I wanted to know the FPS as well in my config testing. What I went to initially was the GeForce Experience but unless you have an Nvidia card that is useless. Also i found that if you dragged an instrument to a second screen I found that it flickered between the 2, or more if you has more than one dragged.

What I eventually settled on was using the MSI Afterburner util. Even if you do not have an MSI graphics card you can use it. The key thing here is that it also installs the Riva Tuner Statistics Server. Now that is the useful bit. You can set that to provide on screen stats for any apps you choose.
I set mine to open with orange stats in the bottom right corner showing FPS GPU % and VMEM % when flightsimulator.exe was running. Very easy,very useful, no drag on performance, and clearly visible.
You might want to give that a try.

Only two days until the Hornet now.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

For sure and thanks for the suggestions. I managed to find an app called "Shift Z Stats" that basically mirrors the shift Z function from FSX and FS9. Separately I use one called "Core Temp" and another one called "Speccy" to monitor those data points. I can also use the GeForce Experience or the My Alienware apps as well. But an all in one would be fantastic!

What I want to know or hear are what others are seeing core temp wise, Ram usage, GPU and CPU wise when the sim is running after the latest update.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

To be honest Mike it is going to be vastly different on each system according to the GPU and CPU. The only guide is somebody has exactly the same setup as you.
What I found was it is best to just use a set airfield and flight to get a standard set of stats and then see what happens when you change something. I found it to be the most useful guide.

To give you an example, I have just done a test flight, on SU7, from Nellis heading down town and got 36fps, using 38% GPU at 60 degs. This however is with everything maxed out and ultra due to the 3080.

I have to say that the mist/smog effect around Vegas is very visual and wasn't there before.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

Running it in DirectX 12 now with no issues after this update.

Gotta say, it is indeed visually stunning at times!

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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

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My early test in DX12 was also very successful.

On our round the world trip we have only really found two big bugbears. One is the amount of times that the visual stitching of the terrain is less than desired. I know that this is due to the quality patchwork of Bing maps so I can't be too hard on them for that.

The second is China.
That is quite frankly woeful. They have most airfields there with no lights at all. It got so that we only flew in daylight due to this. One time we were completing our flight in darkness but was unable to as the small airfield i the middle of a city had nothing. You couldn't see it.
Secondly, the Great Wall of China - isn't. We went to one section of it and found nothing at all. Whilst another had auto-generated apartments. Ridiculous. They have to hand craft one of the most well known structures on the planet. The Forbidden City is done.

Neither of these are sorted in the new update.

I did a daylight flight from Northolt along the Thames, at low level, to Biggin Hill and found that with everything maxed I was averaging 15 fps and sometimes it was stuttering at 9 fps.

So even with the almighty RTX 3080 the sim can be brought down to earth in certain conditions. To be honest, after my testing, I may set everything to High and then push all the sliders right.

Yes I did test the F/A-18E. There is a new control option for afterburners. It kinda works a bit hap-hazard.
What i mean is that you have to be at 100% power and then hit the burner toggle switch and the effect comes in. Reduce the power to below 100% and the burner comes off. Not quite real, and how well that can work with some of TCS throttle systems is something to be found out.
There are two new environmental parms brought in for the Hornet. You can switch on G-Effect and G-Suit preferences.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by MIKE JG »

Saw those, I only played with the Hornet briefly last evening. Certainly the use of Bing Maps is a blessing and a curse. Those using the Google Maps mod seem to have some of the same problems. Not sure how or if they will ever be able to implement seasons at this rate and you're never going to eliminate some of the issues you mentioned with stitching and lack of photo coverage in certain parts of the world.

So much potential though but some things may never be a part of it I'm afraid.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by jetpilot1980 »

Out of curiosity did the Hornet re-introduce proper carrier functions like the ones in FSX / P3D? (wing fold, launch assist and hook)
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Victory103 »

Modeled but no moving carrier options. Took a day for liveries to pop up (I expected the Blue Angels pretty quick). Long time VRS flyer in FS9-P3D, so didn't expect much. I do all my boat ops in DCS now anyway.
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by jetpilot1980 »

When you say modeled as in the shift-I and shift-u ect work again? or is it like the Hard Deck Simulations addon carrier where it just automatically assumes all planes have hook and a bar and just auto catches and launches them? Also as I recall the moving carrier functions / options were not originally in FSX/P3d either (those carriers were stationary or made to move using a ship traffic .bgl and not pitching decks) but rather programmed in by addon devs...
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Re: A brand new MS Flight Simulator is coming...

Post by Firebird »

It will take a little time to fathom things out, like for example does the afterburner trigger only give you an effect or a thrust boost as well.
I intend doing some more testing this morning, time allowing.
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