P-3, Revisited

Discussion, tutorials,hints and tips relating to designing military ai aircraft.
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VulcanDriver
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Post by VulcanDriver »

ronniegj wrote:Sure looks like a photoshop job to me! Look near the wing root where the wing should join in - looks like it is just overlayed. Is this a joke and I'm missing the point?

Ron
Its a concept bird, so metal bending has not started yet, if at all. The Japanese are using a method that the British looked at in the 60's. That is using an existing fuselage (the P3 in this case) and mate it with a new wing / tail surfaces and engines. There was a British proposal to mate the wings of a C-141 to a Short Belfast transport a/c during the early '60s but the project was cancelled.

John
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"That is the biggest fool thing we have ever done. The A-bomb will never go off, and I speak as an expert in explosives." - Admiral William Leahy
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Post by ronniegj »

Thanks for the clarification. Ya' live and learn!

Ron
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Post by aerogator »

Sure looks like a photoshop job to me! Look near the wing root where the wing should join in - looks like it is just overlayed. Is this a joke and I'm missing the point?
That line down the fuselage looks just like my P-3 did when I tried adding a door and redoing the polys :lol: :lol: Part of that looking like it doesn't line up is the leading edge flaps extended, I think.
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Post by aerogator »

Update... I finally got the winshield and eyebrow windows painted thanks to help from Weescotty and Dark Morelia. Here's what the LOD count looks like now:

LOD 1: 5104
LOD 2: 4160
LOD 3: 2656
LOD 4: 1748
LOD 5: 1618
LOD 6: 1150
LOD 7: 186
LOD 8: 30
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StingingCanine
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Post by StingingCanine »

That looks sweet!
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Post by ronniegj »

That bird now is in the 'Superior' category as far as I'm concerned!

Will it be released first as part of a package, or as a standalone? How many separate models will you eventually produce?

So very much appreciate your efforts on this, Jake.

Ron
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Post by aerogator »

Thanks, Ron. Still a lot of little things to finish up. If anyone has a good shot of the sonobouy tube panel that I could use to texture that part (make a decal from), I would appreciate it. And I still do not have the t/o flaps worked out yet. If anyone can teach a brick how to write .xml code :lol: (or would write it for me), let me know.

I'm really ready to get this one out of the hanger. Its been a long gestation peiod :D .

Thanks to everyone for the help and support along the way :D .
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Post by aerogator »

Added wires. Here are some pics. Still looking for someone to lead me through the take/off flaps xml stuff :oops: .
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flyerkg
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Post by flyerkg »

Jake,

This P-3 model will be great to have at Kanehoe Bay. I am using a pretty nice flyable there now for AI, but they slow things down a bit. As far as teaching a brick XML, I am reading a book titled XML Demystified. It takes you through a lot of the basics such as tags, attributes, schema, and the many other aspects of XML. It would be a long time before I could ever do anything constructive with this.

Keith
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Post by RipPipPip »

aerogator wrote:Added wires. Here are some pics. Still looking for someone to lead me through the take/off flaps xml stuff :oops: .
Hey Jake, check this one (the end especially):
Visibility condition XML and animated take-off flaps: http://www.militaryaiworks.com/forum/vi ... highlight=
and if you'll have following questions, please ask.
"For a few FPS more"
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Post by aerogator »

Hey Rip, Thanks for the help. I think I need to know what exactly is xml or maybe how the code affects the fs model. In other words, when you copy and paste this code into the MakeMDL file, how does it take affect? Is it applied to the next model that is compiled or does it modify the fs engine. As you can see from my questions, I have no understanding of this at all :oops: . I need help with the basics.

I really want to know how to do this so I can do it myself in the future but I think I'm going to have to see how yours or Pascal's code can be applied to the P-3. Just looking at the code, I don't know if I need to change anything or not to use it with my model.

Sorry if I seem so dense, but I think maybe the problem is the only programming I ever had was 40 years ago (literally). I was in the very first computer class ever offered at the college I went to (1968), and things were very different then (key punch and cards, same idea with the commands but as you can imagine, I've forgotten most of it now).

Anyhow, if you still want to help, I would certainly appreciate it. Or maybe you can point me to a reference of some kind.

Thanks again :D ,
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Post by RipPipPip »

OK Jake, let's go to the basics.

The XML code should go to the file MakeMDL.parts.xml, which is located on your disk, just where you installed Microsoft SDK MakeMDL_SDK.
You insert the code just after the statement:

Code: Select all

<part_dictionary>

>>> HERE <<<
using a text editor, and save it.

Then, when you compile again your model, then the new model (.mdl) has your inputted code "built in".

What I mean "the code"?
For example:

Code: Select all

<part>
  <name>anim_Spoiler_C</name>
    <animation>
      <parameter>
        <code>
	  (A:RADIO HEIGHT, feet) 50 < (A:FLAPS HANDLE PERCENT, percent) 99 > 50 * *
        </code>
        <lag>20</lag>
      </parameter>
    </animation>
</part>
How do we "consume" that code?
It's easy - this way, when you'll give a part in your FSDS3 model the name "anim_Spoiler_C", then the part called "anim_Spoiler_C" will behave just how the XML tells it to.

You have to make an animation for a keyframe 0 and for a keyframe 50, for the above example.
When the condition is FALSE then all the above code "returns" 0 and this is our 0 keyframe. It corresponds to that spoiler is retracted.
When the plane is lower than 50ft AND flaps are fully deployed (we are landing) then the condition returns ... 50.
This is our keyframe 50 so we move the spoiler for the keyframe 50 to the deployed state.

Well, all that XML stuff is not very easy but after some training you should catch the clue.
"For a few FPS more"
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Rysiek Winawer
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Post by aerogator »

Well, all that XML stuff is not very easy but after some training you should catch the clue
No kidding :lol: :lol:

I had figured out, with the help of Kev sometime back, how to get the code in MakeMDL using notepad but I could never understand the commands. Thanks for going to the basics because I did not understand if changing the code affected the model itself or something in the FS engine.

Where does the part name: 'anim_Spoiler_C' come from? I could not find that naming convention in FSDS. Do I name the part 'l_spoiler', anim_Spoiler_C in FSDS or do I call this part 'anim_l_spoiler' in the xml code? (hope this makes sense) And how do I know this name is accepted by FSDS? If you can clear up the naming convention for me, maybe I can get to where I can experiment a bit. :)

Thanks again for your patience, :D
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Post by RipPipPip »

Sorry, I was not sure what you mean "basics" 8)
Some others will benefit then, maybe :)

No, no, the name anim_Spoiler_C was invented by me :wink: , you could use (almost) whatever. I wanted it meaningful.
I mean "almost", because you should not use those names that are already defined in FSDS3, like "l_spoiler" for example, to prevent conflict (would not work at all?).
When you name a part anim_Spoiler_C in your FSDS3 model AND you have a chunk of XML code in MakeMDL.parts.xml with the same name, then the name connects the code with the part - this way you define how the part will work, from pop up or animation point of view.
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Post by aerogator »

When you name a part anim_Spoiler_C in your FSDS3 model AND you have a chunk of XML code in MakeMDL.parts.xml with the same name, then the name connects the code with the part - this way you define how the part will work, from pop up or animation point of view.
OK, now it makes more sense. IOW, the new name makes sure the part is activated by the xml code and not by the the standard animation. :idea: 8) .

And when I say basics, thats what I mean: the begining :lol: I'm glad you included that.

Thanks again, and 'bricks' can learn after all, maybe a little more slowly :lol:
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Post by Psuls »

Don't worry Jake, it took me a while as well to understand the basics :D
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Post by aerogator »

YAHOO!!! We've got take-off flaps!! :D :D However, I've got some adjusting to do on the speed for the other settings. On approach they start out right but then retract and extend a couple of times and don't go to full until on the ground so I've got to play around with it some. But at least I can experiment now.

Thanks to all who helped!! If anyone has tricks for the other speeds, I'd like to know, otherwise I'll keep experimenting. And BTW, does the FDE come in to play here at all?
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Re: P-3 Variants

Post by EJ »

swp53 wrote: P.S. Have not found any flightplans for Spanish P-3's out of Moron AB so will write some myself and post them when finished.
Don´t worry about, i have this FP´s made with serial numbers and tail numbers, and if the creators need, pictures of Spanish 5 P3B, realliy TACNAVMOD BLOCK II or SUPER BEES, and the 2 remaining ALPHA DELTIC.

I use usually mike stone´s model in my AI, i have almost 8 diefren models of P3 with this FP´s, included Spain Air Force.
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Post by EJ »

P3_Super_Bee wrote:All the Aircraft pics are of a P-3C AIP... There is a line drawings of the P-3C UIII-P and the P-3C UIII-R at the bottom along with a little of what an AIP has that an UIII don't. For the USN P-3C Family for AI, You only really need two models the UIII don't matter if a R or a P and an AIP. Most people won't notice the slight antennae differences between the UII, UII.5, and UIII-P, & UIII-R they we still fly.
I think the more obviously diferences are, in the Update II and II.5 AN/ALD2 system was changes by AN/ALR78 in a right wing pod, in the Update III this system was changed by the new AN/ALR66V3, and the pod disappears, in AIP and BMIP planes, like CUP configuration, this system changes again for the new AN/ALR95, and new pod appears en the back, the DF antenna after de ARR532 receptor antennas.

The IRDS system changes too, and change for L3/Wescam MX20 in the nose.

The launch tubes for the sonobuoys in the back, are another thing that appears in Charlies model, not had in the same way in Bravo and Alpha models.
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Post by EJ »

P3_Super_Bee wrote:Problem is the thing is 39MB, and password protected... So can't break it up into smaller sizes, email it, or take the pics out of it
I´ll kill for this document :-)

This must be completly marvellous
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