Making landclass with SBuilder

[kungfuman]

It's good help, except I can't try it out as I'm having trouble with drawing the exclude rectangle in SB.

I use the aircraft position in FS to control the "crosshairs" in SB, but when I click to place the second defining point of the exclusion, the first point jumps to the same location as the second point.

[MIKE JG]

Try unchecking "show aircaft" in the SB menu. Then just guesstimate the two corners needed for the exclusion.

[LEBTowerGuy]

If you want to get the size right, then try making a temperary polygon, then disable the follow aircraft and add your exclusion square based on the size of the polygon.

[kungfuman]

If you want to get the size right, then try making a temperary polygon, then disable the follow aircraft and add your exclusion square based on the size of the polygon.

Exactly what I was thinking...

[LEBTowerGuy]

I have also found that when building an airport, an easy way to get the outlines exact, is to place taxiways around the perimiter of the airport, and then, using the sim, place a poly point following the taxiway you built, its an easy way to make sure everything lines up nicely.

[kungfuman]

A great tip!

[kungfuman]

Is it possible to "open" and view existing land class files in SB? Not SB land class projects, but actual .bgl files?

Or is there another program that will do this (other than FS9, of course).

[MIKE JG]

Dan, I think this about the only tool that will do what you are looking for. Install it, and see if it gives you the info you want. Note it is a bit tricky to use so make sure to RTFM.

http://www.jimkeir.co.uk/FlightSim/LWMViewer.html

[kungfuman]

Dan, I think this about the only tool that will do what you are looking for. Install it, and see if it gives you the info you want. Note it is a bit tricky to use so make sure to RTFM.

http://www.jimkeir.co.uk/FlightSim/LWMViewer.html

Thanks!

"RTFM" - this must mean "Read the f****** manual"?

Cheers,

Dan

[BadPvtDan]

Lol Mike is just using the abbreviation for reading the manual and NOT it's more direct connotation.

[kungfuman]

I'm still in the stone-age when it comes to common blog-o-nyms Turns out my guess was spot-on, although it was fairly obvious... I've only recently started using things like HTH and AFAIK , not to mention "smileys"!


Btw Mike, you mentioned the naming of the land class file output from SB.

It turns out that the numbers are a shorthand for the scenery area - ie. they reference the first four numbers of the co-incident AB******.bgl, AP******.bgl, FL******.bgl etc. files.

Which means that if you create more than one land class modification for the same area, you will either have to rename your files, or they will have to go in seperate folders.

Seeing as I'm currently creating something inspired by the good work of MAIW, I wish to follow whatever practices you would also use (you are the best, after all ). So, what would you do in this scenario:

Rename the land class file?

or, have more than one folder for land class?


My guess would be that one could put the land class in the "scenery" folder for the given airfield, provided that there will be no need for a "texture" folder. But, what if there is a need for a texture folder?

Thanks again folks,

Dan

[MIKE JG]

Btw Mike, you mentioned the naming of the land class file output from SB. It turns out that the numbers are a shorthand for the scenery area - ie. they reference the first four numbers of the co-incident AB******.bgl, AP******.bgl, FL******.bgl etc. files. Which means that if you create more than one land class modification for the same area, you will either have to rename your files, or they will have to go in seperate folders.

So, what would you do in this scenario:

Rename the land class file?

or, have more than one folder for land class?

My guess would be that one could put the land class in the "scenery" folder for the given airfield, provided that there will be no need for a "texture" folder. But, what if there is a need for a texture folder?

I guess I don't really follow your line of thinking here. Are you asking what if there are multiple land class addon files made for the same cell? IOW, if I made one for say Andrews AFB and the surrounding area and put it in a package, then you came along and made a separate set of land class files for the same area to add even more detail and accuracy? So in this example, you would have 4 or 5 different land class files, made by separate authors, compiled at different times, but designed for the same LOD cell? Following this line of logic, SBuilder would spit out the same exact land class file names for these separately made files?

Is that the type of scenario you are asking about?

[kungfuman]

Well, I may certainly be mistaken, but the scenery area defined by only the first four numbers is actually quite a large area. Because the SB land class file output only uses those first four numbers in the APabcdef.bgl file names, SB will produce the same file name for a selection of APabcd**.bgl file areas - all those starting with "abcd". So the same file name will be produced for an entire LOD X cell (X being a lower number than Y), where the LOD Y cells are the size of the AB/AP/FL/etc/abcdef.bgl file areas.

I have two airfields within such an area that both require landclass modification (they are at opposite ends of the LOD cell, seperated by about 130 NM). SB produces the same file name for them both. I was just wondering how I should handle them. It also occured to me that having them in seperate active folders may not work - given the files have the same name - as FS will probably replace the info of one with the info of the other when it loads the data (like when you have more than one active afcad for the same airfield).

This is just conjecture on my part. I don't know how good my understanding of these matters really is.

[MIKE JG]

In the bonus scenery from the Nellis package, the Nevada Test and Training Range complex, I made land class mods to add in the dry salt lakes and I did so using 3 or 4 different SB projects. AFAIK, it all works perfectly and that is quite a large area that this scenery covers. I think I ended up with 3 different land class files. They all sit in the MAIW Land Class folder.

Have you tried just making what you need to make and checking it in game? I've honestly not seen anyone else raise this issue before so I'm thinking that it is not a problem.

[kungfuman]

OK, I think you did something fairly obvious, that I should've realised .

Because there is only one file within the MAIW Land Class\scenery folder, you must've combined your different areas of land class modification into one file - or rather, one SB project. Then when you compiled your land class bgl, you would've selected all the different areas of landclass - and SB did the rest, putting it all in one file. If that's the case, I will do the same. As I said, I should've probably thought of that.

Cheers,

Dan

ps. I note that you rename your land class file to something easier to recognise...

[MIKE JG]

Some of them yes, others no. Since the names themselves have some sort of scenery priority properties to them, if there are going to be several files for the same area, as in the case of the NTTR land class, I will leave them as SB names them coming out of BGL Comp. If I know there is only going to be one land class file for one area, and it might interfere with other addon files for that same area, I will change the name so that users can easily recognize it and remove it should they chose to do so. Again, with the Nellis package, I made a small mod for the area adjacent to Nellis AFB, and named it accordingly because I'm assuming that I will not ever make another land class file for that same LOD.

Does that make sense?

[kungfuman]

Where did you put the land class for the nttr?

The only land class file in the "Nellis" package is called: "Addon Scenery\MAIW Land Class\Scenery\Nellis Land Class.bgl"

Unless there is land class in another folder as well?

[kungfuman]

I'm sorry to be so persistent.

Just trying to get to the bottom of it is all.

I do also need to try out some of this myself, so please don't feel obliged to provide a running commentary if you have better things to be doing.

Having said that, your input here has been extremely valuable

Many thanks,

Dan

[MIKE JG]

Dan you don't have the easter egg installed if you only have one Nellis related land class file.

The easter egg is hidden inside the voicepacks folder from the Nellis package. It is a separate .exe autoinstaller that will add that scenery to that area. It will place three new land class files into the MAIW Land Class folder. Their names are:

NTTR Land Class_LD_1618.bgl
NTTR Land Class_LD_1718.bgl
NTTR Land Class_LD_1719.bgl.

Notice even though I used a custom name as a prefix, it is the exact same for all three. So in theory, if there is a priority conflict, FS9 should go all the way to the numbers in each name to assign each file's scenery priority.

BTW, I don't mind the questions at all. I only wish when I was first struggling to learn SBuilder back in 2006 that I had had someone's brain to pick.

[kungfuman]

NTTR Land Class_LD_1618.bgl
NTTR Land Class_LD_1718.bgl
NTTR Land Class_LD_1719.bgl.

These are the three NTTR land class files, and I assume that the last parts of the file name starting "LD" are the original filenames that were carried over from the SB output files.

As I mentioned above, those numbers refer to parts of the grid. In general, each cell normally has a 6-digit reference number, that normally has an associated AB9****0.bgl file, AP9****0.bgl file, FL9****0.bgl file, HL9****0.bgl file, etc. The four **** digits are apparently what the SB output file uses in its "LD_****" name. Therefore, SB output filenames are geographically specific, not project specific.

My own problem is that I have more than one project in the same LOD cell (the projects do not physically overlap - they are two different areas seperated by about a hundred miles), so SB outputs these two different projects with the same name (LD_6821). My fear is that if I rename them (so they can go in the same land class folder) they will still have some sort of internal "tag", meaning that MSFS will only have one of them active at a given time (like with afcads).

I will report back, eventually